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Knot on each of client's erector spinae muscles

An ABMP member recently spoke of a client he has with a huge knot on each of his erector spinae muscles. What's your approach to working these sorts of knots out?

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Permalink Reply by Chantel Martin on April 23, 2015 at 2:35pm

Trigger Point Therapy is something I practice a lot. I've noticed that the erector spinae muscles are a very common site for knots. First I'll warm the area and prepare it for deep work, using effleurage, and working deeper as I go. And then I use my elbows to specifically address the trigger point, making sure to be effective without damaging my client. I was trained to use a pain scale to be sure that I'm not working too deep or too light, because each person naturally has a different threshold of pain. The key is to be patient, not working too deep too quickly, and allowing the muscle to let its guard down so that you may manipulate and relax it. That way it doesn't guard against you, worsening the condition.

Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 24, 2015 at 2:02am
Just something to think about. As a follow up to what Chantel said in the above paragraph.. You could try this technique near the end of your massage or when your client turns and lays on their back. If you dig and dig on a trigger point a little too much, you stand the chance of actually perpetuating the trigger point by causing even more damage to the muscle cells. Here is another way of attacking the lumbar paraspinal trigger point ( or ponts ) that you've already worked on, in a way that will have a lot less chance of causing further cellular damage, and may actually release the trigger point in and of it self. I used the technique today sort of like an insurance policy to help back up the TP work I had done early on in the massage. I've found out over the years that if you get the nervous system on your side when working on deactivating a trigger point, your success is much greater. Its like swiming down stream as opposed to up stream. Uhm, when one muscle gets tight, another muscle gets loose. If that was not the case, we could not move. When one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose. When one muscle contracts, the opposite muscle, antagonist or whatever relaxes. Thats hard wiered into the body.. No escape from that reflex. Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex. If you are layin on your back and start to do a sit up.. In the very beggining when your neck starts to lift off the floor your SCMs as well as your Abdominals and most of the rest of the front part of your body contracts ( tightens up ). That means, do to the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, that your lower back and Lumbars have to relax. The brain actually sends a signal to the lumbars to loosen up and relax..Of course if you continiue to do the entire sit up, there is eventual strain and tightening on the lower back.. but not in the very begining of the exercise.. So i have my client, while laying on their back , lift their chin towards their chest.. Keeping their shoulders on the ground ( not lifting the shoulders ). If it stains the client of course this is not the technique you should do. While they hold that position you will notice the SCMss and Abbs tightening up quite a bit. At the same time before you have your client lift their chin to their chest, you have placed your hand or fingers under the body directly or over the trigger point area. Not pussing on the trigger points... Just resting you hand or palm of hand over the trigger pointed area.. Lumbar 2 and 3 lets say. . With the clients back of the head off the table and their chin towards their chest.. Not much effort on their part. And with your hand resting on ( under ) the trigger point, the nervous system directs signals of relaxation directly to the lower back and specifically to the area where you hand is touching the body( directed by the perifpheral nervous system. The Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body.. There is no excape.. Even though the client may not feel anything happening, their brain is sending signals to the lower back to loosen up.. I had my client hold that position for about ten or fifteen seconds.. rest for a few seconsd then repeate that a coupld more times... The client may not feel anything, but the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body. You can read about it in Wikipedia if you want.. Just something to think about.
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 24, 2015 at 2:41am
Uhm, I just re read the above paragraph.. There are some errors.. In one sentece above when talking about the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex.. I said that when one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose.. I ment to say when one side of the bone gets tight, the other side gets loose.. in the above situation ... When the front of the body gets tight, the back of the body gets loose.
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 24, 2015 at 4:45am
When the front muscles get tight, the back muscles get loose. Attachment below is the front muscles.
Attachments:
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 24, 2015 at 4:47am
The back muscles.
Attachments:
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 24, 2015 at 3:02pm
There are some advanced acupressure techniques that magically take out trigger points in seconds. I'm thinking about teaching them at some point. Maybe next year.
Attachments:
Permalink Reply by Gary W Addis, LMT on April 27, 2015 at 3:12pm

Hi, Tara, fancy meeting you here! 

Permalink Reply by Gary W Addis, LMT on April 27, 2015 at 3:26pm

Very well said, Gordon!  In another forum, I've been involved for days in a discussion with an LMT who stridently denies that trigger point therapy works.  Instead, the guy insists that all muscle dysfunction can be corrected by transverse and circular friction of the tendon attachments.  He admits that in 20 years of practice he has released only a handful of trigger points, and none at all in the last 12 years.  Sigh.  Seems that a significant percentage of LMTs couldn't locate a trigger point if it bit them on the tip of a finger when they glide across it.

As you often say, Gordon, TRUTH remains hidden.

Gordon J. Wallis said:

Just something to think about. As a follow up to what Chantel said in the above paragraph.. You could try this technique near the end of your massage or when your client turns and lays on their back. If you dig and dig on a trigger point a little too much, you stand the chance of actually perpetuating the trigger point by causing even more damage to the muscle cells. Here is another way of attacking the lumbar paraspinal trigger point ( or ponts ) that you've already worked on, in a way that will have a lot less chance of causing further cellular damage, and may actually release the trigger point in and of it self. I used the technique today sort of like an insurance policy to help back up the TP work I had done early on in the massage. I've found out over the years that if you get the nervous system on your side when working on deactivating a trigger point, your success is much greater. Its like swiming down stream as opposed to up stream. Uhm, when one muscle gets tight, another muscle gets loose. If that was not the case, we could not move. When one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose. When one muscle contracts, the opposite muscle, antagonist or whatever relaxes. Thats hard wiered into the body.. No escape from that reflex. Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex. If you are layin on your back and start to do a sit up.. In the very beggining when your neck starts to lift off the floor your SCMs as well as your Abdominals and most of the rest of the front part of your body contracts ( tightens up ). That means, do to the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, that your lower back and Lumbars have to relax. The brain actually sends a signal to the lumbars to loosen up and relax..Of course if you continiue to do the entire sit up, there is eventual strain and tightening on the lower back.. but not in the very begining of the exercise.. So i have my client, while laying on their back , lift their chin towards their chest.. Keeping their shoulders on the ground ( not lifting the shoulders ). If it stains the client of course this is not the technique you should do. While they hold that position you will notice the SCMss and Abbs tightening up quite a bit. At the same time before you have your client lift their chin to their chest, you have placed your hand or fingers under the body directly or over the trigger point area. Not pussing on the trigger points... Just resting you hand or palm of hand over the trigger pointed area.. Lumbar 2 and 3 lets say. . With the clients back of the head off the table and their chin towards their chest.. Not much effort on their part. And with your hand resting on ( under ) the trigger point, the nervous system directs signals of relaxation directly to the lower back and specifically to the area where you hand is touching the body( directed by the perifpheral nervous system. The Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body.. There is no excape.. Even though the client may not feel anything happening, their brain is sending signals to the lower back to loosen up.. I had my client hold that position for about ten or fifteen seconds.. rest for a few seconsd then repeate that a coupld more times... The client may not feel anything, but the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body. You can read about it in Wikipedia if you want.. Just something to think about.
Permalink Reply by Chantel Martin on April 27, 2015 at 9:09pm

Very smart, Gordon. I have a feeling we can all learn a lot from you. I'll probably be hanging around and listening to you more often.

I was told about the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, and massage methods associated with it, but I have not yet had any training in it. Out of curiosity and sheer lack of experience in the area, do you find that this method removes the trigger points completely? Or does it just somewhat alleviate the discomfort for a period of time?

Gordon J. Wallis said:

Just something to think about. As a follow up to what Chantel said in the above paragraph.. You could try this technique near the end of your massage or when your client turns and lays on their back. If you dig and dig on a trigger point a little too much, you stand the chance of actually perpetuating the trigger point by causing even more damage to the muscle cells. Here is another way of attacking the lumbar paraspinal trigger point ( or ponts ) that you've already worked on, in a way that will have a lot less chance of causing further cellular damage, and may actually release the trigger point in and of it self. I used the technique today sort of like an insurance policy to help back up the TP work I had done early on in the massage. I've found out over the years that if you get the nervous system on your side when working on deactivating a trigger point, your success is much greater. Its like swiming down stream as opposed to up stream. Uhm, when one muscle gets tight, another muscle gets loose. If that was not the case, we could not move. When one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose. When one muscle contracts, the opposite muscle, antagonist or whatever relaxes. Thats hard wiered into the body.. No escape from that reflex. Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex. If you are layin on your back and start to do a sit up.. In the very beggining when your neck starts to lift off the floor your SCMs as well as your Abdominals and most of the rest of the front part of your body contracts ( tightens up ). That means, do to the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, that your lower back and Lumbars have to relax. The brain actually sends a signal to the lumbars to loosen up and relax..Of course if you continiue to do the entire sit up, there is eventual strain and tightening on the lower back.. but not in the very begining of the exercise.. So i have my client, while laying on their back , lift their chin towards their chest.. Keeping their shoulders on the ground ( not lifting the shoulders ). If it stains the client of course this is not the technique you should do. While they hold that position you will notice the SCMss and Abbs tightening up quite a bit. At the same time before you have your client lift their chin to their chest, you have placed your hand or fingers under the body directly or over the trigger point area. Not pussing on the trigger points... Just resting you hand or palm of hand over the trigger pointed area.. Lumbar 2 and 3 lets say. . With the clients back of the head off the table and their chin towards their chest.. Not much effort on their part. And with your hand resting on ( under ) the trigger point, the nervous system directs signals of relaxation directly to the lower back and specifically to the area where you hand is touching the body( directed by the perifpheral nervous system. The Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body.. There is no excape.. Even though the client may not feel anything happening, their brain is sending signals to the lower back to loosen up.. I had my client hold that position for about ten or fifteen seconds.. rest for a few seconsd then repeate that a coupld more times... The client may not feel anything, but the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body. You can read about it in Wikipedia if you want.. Just something to think about.
Permalink Reply by Gary W Addis, LMT on April 27, 2015 at 11:13pm

Chantel,

Many massage therapists become bored with the work before they've given their 100th massage.  Gordon has been practicing for more than three decades, and he's still as eager to learn as a toddler taking his first steps.  Gordon is generous with his storehouse of knowledge. You've discovered a great resource!

Chantel Martin said:

Very smart, Gordon. I have a feeling we can all learn a lot from you. I'll probably be hanging around and listening to you more often.

I was told about the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, and massage methods associated with it, but I have not yet had any training in it. Out of curiosity and sheer lack of experience in the area, do you find that this method removes the trigger points completely? Or does it just somewhat alleviate the discomfort for a period of time?

Gordon J. Wallis said:

Just something to think about. As a follow up to what Chantel said in the above paragraph.. You could try this technique near the end of your massage or when your client turns and lays on their back. If you dig and dig on a trigger point a little too much, you stand the chance of actually perpetuating the trigger point by causing even more damage to the muscle cells. Here is another way of attacking the lumbar paraspinal trigger point ( or ponts ) that you've already worked on, in a way that will have a lot less chance of causing further cellular damage, and may actually release the trigger point in and of it self. I used the technique today sort of like an insurance policy to help back up the TP work I had done early on in the massage. I've found out over the years that if you get the nervous system on your side when working on deactivating a trigger point, your success is much greater. Its like swiming down stream as opposed to up stream. Uhm, when one muscle gets tight, another muscle gets loose. If that was not the case, we could not move. When one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose. When one muscle contracts, the opposite muscle, antagonist or whatever relaxes. Thats hard wiered into the body.. No escape from that reflex. Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex. If you are layin on your back and start to do a sit up.. In the very beggining when your neck starts to lift off the floor your SCMs as well as your Abdominals and most of the rest of the front part of your body contracts ( tightens up ). That means, do to the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, that your lower back and Lumbars have to relax. The brain actually sends a signal to the lumbars to loosen up and relax..Of course if you continiue to do the entire sit up, there is eventual strain and tightening on the lower back.. but not in the very begining of the exercise.. So i have my client, while laying on their back , lift their chin towards their chest.. Keeping their shoulders on the ground ( not lifting the shoulders ). If it stains the client of course this is not the technique you should do. While they hold that position you will notice the SCMss and Abbs tightening up quite a bit. At the same time before you have your client lift their chin to their chest, you have placed your hand or fingers under the body directly or over the trigger point area. Not pussing on the trigger points... Just resting you hand or palm of hand over the trigger pointed area.. Lumbar 2 and 3 lets say. . With the clients back of the head off the table and their chin towards their chest.. Not much effort on their part. And with your hand resting on ( under ) the trigger point, the nervous system directs signals of relaxation directly to the lower back and specifically to the area where you hand is touching the body( directed by the perifpheral nervous system. The Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body.. There is no excape.. Even though the client may not feel anything happening, their brain is sending signals to the lower back to loosen up.. I had my client hold that position for about ten or fifteen seconds.. rest for a few seconsd then repeate that a coupld more times... The client may not feel anything, but the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body. You can read about it in Wikipedia if you want.. Just something to think about.
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 28, 2015 at 6:27am

I meet at least 100 trigger points every week.. They are more real that whats known. That guy, whoever he is.. just has to spend one week with me. He will see more trigger points then there are stars in th sky.. lol well not quite..but almost.
Gary W Addis, LMT said:

Very well said, Gordon!  In another forum, I've been involved for days in a discussion with an LMT who stridently denies that trigger point therapy works.  Instead, the guy insists that all muscle dysfunction can be corrected by transverse and circular friction of the tendon attachments.  He admits that in 20 years of practice he has released only a handful of trigger points, and none at all in the last 12 years.  Sigh.  Seems that a significant percentage of LMTs couldn't locate a trigger point if it bit them on the tip of a finger when they glide across it.

As you often say, Gordon, TRUTH remains hidden.

Gordon J. Wallis said:

Just something to think about. As a follow up to what Chantel said in the above paragraph.. You could try this technique near the end of your massage or when your client turns and lays on their back. If you dig and dig on a trigger point a little too much, you stand the chance of actually perpetuating the trigger point by causing even more damage to the muscle cells. Here is another way of attacking the lumbar paraspinal trigger point ( or ponts ) that you've already worked on, in a way that will have a lot less chance of causing further cellular damage, and may actually release the trigger point in and of it self. I used the technique today sort of like an insurance policy to help back up the TP work I had done early on in the massage. I've found out over the years that if you get the nervous system on your side when working on deactivating a trigger point, your success is much greater. Its like swiming down stream as opposed to up stream. Uhm, when one muscle gets tight, another muscle gets loose. If that was not the case, we could not move. When one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose. When one muscle contracts, the opposite muscle, antagonist or whatever relaxes. Thats hard wiered into the body.. No escape from that reflex. Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex. If you are layin on your back and start to do a sit up.. In the very beggining when your neck starts to lift off the floor your SCMs as well as your Abdominals and most of the rest of the front part of your body contracts ( tightens up ). That means, do to the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, that your lower back and Lumbars have to relax. The brain actually sends a signal to the lumbars to loosen up and relax..Of course if you continiue to do the entire sit up, there is eventual strain and tightening on the lower back.. but not in the very begining of the exercise.. So i have my client, while laying on their back , lift their chin towards their chest.. Keeping their shoulders on the ground ( not lifting the shoulders ). If it stains the client of course this is not the technique you should do. While they hold that position you will notice the SCMss and Abbs tightening up quite a bit. At the same time before you have your client lift their chin to their chest, you have placed your hand or fingers under the body directly or over the trigger point area. Not pussing on the trigger points... Just resting you hand or palm of hand over the trigger pointed area.. Lumbar 2 and 3 lets say. . With the clients back of the head off the table and their chin towards their chest.. Not much effort on their part. And with your hand resting on ( under ) the trigger point, the nervous system directs signals of relaxation directly to the lower back and specifically to the area where you hand is touching the body( directed by the perifpheral nervous system. The Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body.. There is no excape.. Even though the client may not feel anything happening, their brain is sending signals to the lower back to loosen up.. I had my client hold that position for about ten or fifteen seconds.. rest for a few seconsd then repeate that a coupld more times... The client may not feel anything, but the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body. You can read about it in Wikipedia if you want.. Just something to think about.
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on April 28, 2015 at 6:31am

Short answer.. THEY ARE GONE FOREVER.
Chantel Martin said:

Very smart, Gordon. I have a feeling we can all learn a lot from you. I'll probably be hanging around and listening to you more often.

I was told about the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, and massage methods associated with it, but I have not yet had any training in it. Out of curiosity and sheer lack of experience in the area, do you find that this method removes the trigger points completely? Or does it just somewhat alleviate the discomfort for a period of time?

Gordon J. Wallis said:

Just something to think about. As a follow up to what Chantel said in the above paragraph.. You could try this technique near the end of your massage or when your client turns and lays on their back. If you dig and dig on a trigger point a little too much, you stand the chance of actually perpetuating the trigger point by causing even more damage to the muscle cells. Here is another way of attacking the lumbar paraspinal trigger point ( or ponts ) that you've already worked on, in a way that will have a lot less chance of causing further cellular damage, and may actually release the trigger point in and of it self. I used the technique today sort of like an insurance policy to help back up the TP work I had done early on in the massage. I've found out over the years that if you get the nervous system on your side when working on deactivating a trigger point, your success is much greater. Its like swiming down stream as opposed to up stream. Uhm, when one muscle gets tight, another muscle gets loose. If that was not the case, we could not move. When one side of the muscle gets tight, the other side gets loose. When one muscle contracts, the opposite muscle, antagonist or whatever relaxes. Thats hard wiered into the body.. No escape from that reflex. Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex. If you are layin on your back and start to do a sit up.. In the very beggining when your neck starts to lift off the floor your SCMs as well as your Abdominals and most of the rest of the front part of your body contracts ( tightens up ). That means, do to the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex, that your lower back and Lumbars have to relax. The brain actually sends a signal to the lumbars to loosen up and relax..Of course if you continiue to do the entire sit up, there is eventual strain and tightening on the lower back.. but not in the very begining of the exercise.. So i have my client, while laying on their back , lift their chin towards their chest.. Keeping their shoulders on the ground ( not lifting the shoulders ). If it stains the client of course this is not the technique you should do. While they hold that position you will notice the SCMss and Abbs tightening up quite a bit. At the same time before you have your client lift their chin to their chest, you have placed your hand or fingers under the body directly or over the trigger point area. Not pussing on the trigger points... Just resting you hand or palm of hand over the trigger pointed area.. Lumbar 2 and 3 lets say. . With the clients back of the head off the table and their chin towards their chest.. Not much effort on their part. And with your hand resting on ( under ) the trigger point, the nervous system directs signals of relaxation directly to the lower back and specifically to the area where you hand is touching the body( directed by the perifpheral nervous system. The Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body.. There is no excape.. Even though the client may not feel anything happening, their brain is sending signals to the lower back to loosen up.. I had my client hold that position for about ten or fifteen seconds.. rest for a few seconsd then repeate that a coupld more times... The client may not feel anything, but the Reciprocal Inhibition Reflex is hard wired into the body. You can read about it in Wikipedia if you want.. Just something to think about.

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