massage and bodywork professionals
a community of practitioners
Just thinking outloud ?
Lets say someone has a very sore deltoid muscle in his right shoulder...A chiropractor will want to adjust the neck because the C-5 nerve root supplies the motor and sensory control for that area of the body. In other words. A chiropractor will try to turn the pain off spinally...So do you think there is a way that a therapist can manually work that C-5 nerve root area in order to stop the pain in that deltoid via the spine, like the chiropractors try to do?
Views: 302
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Therese Schwartz on
-
I don't know about massage, but I'd do CranioSacral work to see if it would help. CST will relieve restrictions in the dural tube that create nerve issues.
-
Permalink Reply by Wilson Jordan on
-
Couple of things first: When you say the Deltoid do you mean the anterior, posterior or medial; rarely does the entire Deltoid go into pain and is there weakness with the pain. Without an indicator of weakness why assume it is is a nerve issue. The Chiropractor is attempting to remove any further frustration by making the said adjustment; I'm not certain that I would agree that the Chiro is attempting to turn of the pain.
The Shoulder is also tied to the Kidneys and Ankles and balances out the hips, so right shoulder pain could also be same side or opposite hip pain if a twist or lift has been involved. Something/s cause the pain to show up and it came from somewhere to protect something. Adjustments often times clear the pathway for the nerve root to optimally fire, which only helps things overall.
Just because pain is felt somewhere does not mean that is what needs to be directly turned off. To perform bodywork on the pathway of the C5 root will keep you in the upper shoulder and mid to lower cervical region. Relaxing both regions and verifying that the upper ribs are also relaxed might do the same thing as his adjustment
-
Permalink Reply by Gordon J. Wallis on
-
Its just a hypothetical question...The pain could be felt anywhere...Sense the chiropractors attempt to turn pain off spinally via the nerve root...I just wonder if a massage therapist can? We can apply pressures and angles on the various vertebrae( nerve roots). Just thinking, pondering. Lets say the thumb hurts...The C-6 nerve root innervates the thumb. So go directly to the spine, C-6 nerve root, and mediate that pain somehow? There must be a way? Im just thinking out loud is all.
-
-
Well for sure the injury could be in the muscles, usually is, ..trigger point of whatever.. But still, the motor and sensory control of that deltoid comes out of the C5 nerve root. That seems to be the basis for a lot of health care in this society. Spinal manipulations and surgeries and such. I just find it a lot easier just to release trigger points in the muscles..That makes a lot of pain go away. This is interesting work for sure.
Jeff Baldwin said:That depends. The question to really ask is, "What came first... the chicken or the egg?"
If nerve entrapment is "chicken" and muscle trauma is "egg", which is the real cause of soreness?
Not all muscle trauma is caused by nerve entrapment. And not all nerve entrapments will cause muscle trauma.
First you'll need to determine what is causing the deltoid to be sore. Muscle trauma? Nerve entrapment?
Because... if the cause is nerve entrapment, then chiropractic and or soft tissue work to the paraspinal muscles that support the facet joints and vertebral position may be effective and may "turn off" the pain.
BUT... if the cause is NOT nerve entrapment, rather the muscle was traumatized otherwise (overuse, direct blow), then chiropractic adjustments or work on the paraspinals and supporting structures will likely not "turn off" the pain.
In other words, don't work on the chicken if the egg is the problem.
- Jeff
-
Permalink Reply by Daniel Cohen on
-
Haven't you ever had a joint release while manipulating soft tissue. Bones may support soft tissue but soft tissue keeps bones in place. And it isn't even always the bone that entraps, it can be the tight muscles. So I vote for soft over hard manipulation.
Gordon J. Wallis said:Well for sure the injury could be in the muscles, usually is, ..trigger point of whatever.. But still, the motor and sensory control of that deltoid comes out of the C5 nerve root. That seems to be the basis for a lot of health care in this society. Spinal manipulations and surgeries and such. I just find it a lot easier just to release trigger points in the muscles..That makes a lot of pain go away. This is interesting work for sure.
Jeff Baldwin said:That depends. The question to really ask is, "What came first... the chicken or the egg?"
If nerve entrapment is "chicken" and muscle trauma is "egg", which is the real cause of soreness?
Not all muscle trauma is caused by nerve entrapment. And not all nerve entrapments will cause muscle trauma.
First you'll need to determine what is causing the deltoid to be sore. Muscle trauma? Nerve entrapment?
Because... if the cause is nerve entrapment, then chiropractic and or soft tissue work to the paraspinal muscles that support the facet joints and vertebral position may be effective and may "turn off" the pain.
BUT... if the cause is NOT nerve entrapment, rather the muscle was traumatized otherwise (overuse, direct blow), then chiropractic adjustments or work on the paraspinals and supporting structures will likely not "turn off" the pain.
In other words, don't work on the chicken if the egg is the problem.
- Jeff
-
-
Yea, soft tissue work, works. Really good.
Daniel Cohen said:Haven't you ever had a joint release while manipulating soft tissue. Bones may support soft tissue but soft tissue keeps bones in place. And it isn't even always the bone that entraps, it can be the tight muscles. So I vote for soft over hard manipulation.
Gordon J. Wallis said:Well for sure the injury could be in the muscles, usually is, ..trigger point of whatever.. But still, the motor and sensory control of that deltoid comes out of the C5 nerve root. That seems to be the basis for a lot of health care in this society. Spinal manipulations and surgeries and such. I just find it a lot easier just to release trigger points in the muscles..That makes a lot of pain go away. This is interesting work for sure.
Jeff Baldwin said:That depends. The question to really ask is, "What came first... the chicken or the egg?"
If nerve entrapment is "chicken" and muscle trauma is "egg", which is the real cause of soreness?
Not all muscle trauma is caused by nerve entrapment. And not all nerve entrapments will cause muscle trauma.
First you'll need to determine what is causing the deltoid to be sore. Muscle trauma? Nerve entrapment?
Because... if the cause is nerve entrapment, then chiropractic and or soft tissue work to the paraspinal muscles that support the facet joints and vertebral position may be effective and may "turn off" the pain.
BUT... if the cause is NOT nerve entrapment, rather the muscle was traumatized otherwise (overuse, direct blow), then chiropractic adjustments or work on the paraspinals and supporting structures will likely not "turn off" the pain.
In other words, don't work on the chicken if the egg is the problem.
- Jeff
-
Permalink Reply by Lucianna Johnston on
-
Possibly. It's also possible that the client has bone spurs at the head of the humerus. It's also possible that the client has an injury to the rotator cuff...or..it's also possible ( I think this was your client if I'm not mistaken) that the client has an active trigger point at the infraspinatus. You know as well as I do that it is trial and error with soft tissue unless you have a picture...I would approach this client with soft tissue work in the neck, upper back, delts and spine. The only way to interpret what else I would do would be to have my hands on them :). Cheers Gordon!
© 2024 Created by ABMP.
Powered by
