massage and bodywork professionals
a community of practitioners
Massage Should Not Be Licensed!
How does this subject make you feel?
Your schooling, training and everything is for not. That's what some on this site are touting as a reason to stop the professions progress thus far with the BOK. They continue to try and tie prostitution and massage together as the reason for licensing. It is not because we wish to enter the healthfield.
Read for yourself at http://www.massageprofessionals.com/group/bodyofknowledge/forum/top...
Instead of working with the leaders of this profession they want to create an entire new bureaucracy . It's your profession. How do you feel?
The following stories should give you a clearer picture of our massage landscape and how those resisting licensure are hurting the profession.
Your schooling, training and everything is for not. That's what some on this site are touting as a reason to stop the professions progress thus far with the BOK. They continue to try and tie prostitution and massage together as the reason for licensing. It is not because we wish to enter the healthfield.
Read for yourself at http://www.massageprofessionals.com/group/bodyofknowledge/forum/top...
Instead of working with the leaders of this profession they want to create an entire new bureaucracy . It's your profession. How do you feel?
The following stories should give you a clearer picture of our massage landscape and how those resisting licensure are hurting the profession.
Views: 771
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Lisa on
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i don't know Mike...this sounds like it could just be a bunch of government officials governing a practice they know nothing about. i am always VERY weary when ANY government body interferes with private practice. when i say "governing" i don't mean government...i mean a national organization.
what credentials will the members be who are picked by the govenor? what guarantee do we as MTs have that this won't turn into a political campaign or kick back? i am more inclined to feel confidence in a massage organization than the government.
why can't we get something like the NCBTMB...something "national" to organize and legitimize our practice? why the government? instead of reinventing the wheel why can't we just fix the pieces that are broken?
you've said a few times that it's "there call not ours". WHY? we as therapists SHOULD have say in how WE are governed. NOT the governor of the state we reside in.
i don't know...i've not had one person yet ask me for my license. and clients seem to be more impressed by the certification than the license. honestly i think most understand that all the license shows is you paid money to the state. certification is what indicates educational standards.
are chiro's and physical therapists certified or licensed? does anyone know the answer to that? i bring them up because i feel they are professions close to ours but widely accepted amongst the public as "legit". are nurses certified or licensed? and how much of the medical professions are licensed only because of pharmaceutical bureaucracy and NOT because of high standards in education?
don't get me wrong. i want MTs to be equal across the board so we all under go the same basic education and then can branch out with specialized education to help us individually stand out amonst our peers. (similar to the medical fields) i want to be able to get my education in one state and work in another. but i DON'T want the government that has NO knowledge of what we do, telling us what to do. that will NOT be good for our profession.
Mike Hinkle said:The following information is my opinion of why you are right!
That's exactly who is doing it, The massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements is the (State) Massage Therapy Board. They are usually picked by the Govenor of the state. The State Massage Board's have gotten together to organize because they saw the industry needs organized. They have already made huge strides in improving the profession.
When associations tried to organize the industry, they were slammed by the other associations and independent therapists. There was little licensing, at that time and it was hard to have any rules. Prostitution was rampant within the industry. Associations promoted licensure hoping to curb the comparisons. States, individually, and with a lot of pressure from therapists within the states started licensing. It has taken decades of effort on AMTA's behalf trying to get us to this point. And yes, I know a lot of folks don't accept that, but it's fact.
The state boards have formed the Federation of States Massage Therapy Boards. This is the organization that will create the Model Practice Act and lead the way to portability among the agreeing states. Will it be all the states? That is up to the states. I would love to see all the states come together. But this is the perfect group to address the entire issue. And they are. I have never felt more confidence in a group as I do this one and their sincere determination to accomplish this for the profession.
At the FSMTB annual meeting, this month, I met people that are lightyears ahead of the average therapist. These people create our hope. I have never been more proud to belong to a profession. And when they finish, you will too.
Lisa said:i'm curious why you feel it needs to be on the state level and not a massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements? and would we still have to get certified AND licensed? that is where i have real issues.
what's the requirements for chiros?
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Permalink Reply by Mike Hinkle on
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Lisa, most of these folks are massage therapists. Do you attend board meetings? These folks are not administrative flunkies that don't know what they are doing. Most that I met have decades in the profession. This is not a private practice. This is a profession that is organizing. There was no national organization until the FSMTB.
Lisa, there is no wheel. We are going to make one. People have talked about one for generations. We have the parts. We have the will. There are therapists at the table. I understand your apprehension. I used to be as well.
Lisa said:i don't know Mike...this sounds like it could just be a bunch of government officials governing a practice they know nothing about. i am always VERY weary when ANY government body interferes with private practice. when i say "governing" i don't mean government...i mean a national organization.
what credentials will the members be who are picked by the govenor? what guarantee do we as MTs have that this won't turn into a political campaign or kick back? i am more inclined to feel confidence in a massage organization than the government.
why can't we get something like the NCBTMB...something "national" to organize and legitimize our practice? why the government? instead of reinventing the wheel why can't we just fix the pieces that are broken?
you've said a few times that it's "there call not ours". WHY? we as therapists SHOULD have say in how WE are governed. NOT the governor of the state we reside in.
i don't know...i've not had one person yet ask me for my license. and clients seem to be more impressed by the certification than the license. honestly i think most understand that all the license shows is you paid money to the state. certification is what indicates educational standards.
are chiro's and physical therapists certified or licensed? does anyone know the answer to that? i bring them up because i feel they are professions close to ours but widely accepted amongst the public as "legit". are nurses certified or licensed? and how much of the medical professions are licensed only because of pharmaceutical bureaucracy and NOT because of high standards in education?
don't get me wrong. i want MTs to be equal across the board so we all under go the same basic education and then can branch out with specialized education to help us individually stand out amonst our peers. (similar to the medical fields) i want to be able to get my education in one state and work in another. but i DON'T want the government that has NO knowledge of what we do, telling us what to do. that will NOT be good for our profession.
Mike Hinkle said:The following information is my opinion of why you are right!
That's exactly who is doing it, The massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements is the (State) Massage Therapy Board. They are usually picked by the Govenor of the state. The State Massage Board's have gotten together to organize because they saw the industry needs organized. They have already made huge strides in improving the profession.
When associations tried to organize the industry, they were slammed by the other associations and independent therapists. There was little licensing, at that time and it was hard to have any rules. Prostitution was rampant within the industry. Associations promoted licensure hoping to curb the comparisons. States, individually, and with a lot of pressure from therapists within the states started licensing. It has taken decades of effort on AMTA's behalf trying to get us to this point. And yes, I know a lot of folks don't accept that, but it's fact.
The state boards have formed the Federation of States Massage Therapy Boards. This is the organization that will create the Model Practice Act and lead the way to portability among the agreeing states. Will it be all the states? That is up to the states. I would love to see all the states come together. But this is the perfect group to address the entire issue. And they are. I have never felt more confidence in a group as I do this one and their sincere determination to accomplish this for the profession.
At the FSMTB annual meeting, this month, I met people that are lightyears ahead of the average therapist. These people create our hope. I have never been more proud to belong to a profession. And when they finish, you will too.
Lisa said:i'm curious why you feel it needs to be on the state level and not a massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements? and would we still have to get certified AND licensed? that is where i have real issues.
what's the requirements for chiros?
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I give up, computers are going to replace us.... yet right! Sounds neat! Does it send out Birthday Cards to the clientel?
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:Yes, it is a really nice computerized system. Each therapist is listed by shift and then the booking is displayed under their name. It is all color coded so we know if someone is coming in for the first time or is a repeat, has been called to confirm the appointment or sent an email confirmation etc. Then for no shows it puts a big X over their info. I have never seen anything like it until now. It also displays special requets by the client for a therapist, if it is Deep Tissue, Reflexology, etc, and Pre Natal etc. You would love it.
Mike Hinkle said:Cool!
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:It really is not a bother to me. There is a display stand on each self in the rooms. The problem is sometimes I do forget to move the license, espeacilly if I have a back to back massage and have to change rooms and the massage has not been communicated correctly on the computer. We have a computerized booking system that is dislayed in the therapist break room so we know if there are couples coming in for a massage. Sometimes the couple is displayed as separate massages, and then changed at the very last minute to a couples massage.
Mike Hinkle said:They are there for a reason. Does it bother you to have to do that? Seems like it takes care of the legit thing. And with the licensure they can check the state page to check if it is real. Sounds easy to me.
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:Where I work now, we have to display our Massage License in the room we are working so the clients have access to them. If we change rooms the license must go with us to the new room. If we do a couples massage the license goes to that room. It is all about the Clients being able to check and see that we are legal LMT's. At the center they were displayed on a bulliten board. No more of that. They are displayed on a stand in the room.
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Permalink Reply by Darcy Neibaur on
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Lisa, I just got off the telephone with my Girlfriend who is a RN and Licensed in the State of Florida and Mississippi. It just so happened that she got off work at midnight tonight and I knew that info. Anyway, They too, have to take so many hours of CEU's in order to renew their license every two years. They also have modalities to study in the medical field just like we do in the massage industry. I was just told that when they complete a new modality they take a National Certification so they can use that modality in whatever state they are working.
I also have a friend who is a PT. I will call her tomorrow and find out what kind of License/Certification she has. I do know she has been a PT for years and has a 4 year degree plus a masters degree in her field.
I am also a CNA Certified in the State of Florida since 1983. I do also have to have CEU's to continue that certification. it is a State Certification, NOT National Certification. I also have to pass one of the moist strictest of background checks in the State of Florida to be able to work with the Elderly, which is one in the same for working in a daycare with children. Elder abuse and child abuse in the State of Florida are looked upon very seriously and are felonies.
Mike has the best interest of all of us at heart. He would never do anything that would hurt us as LMT's or this industy. He was my massage therapist for years, and also mentored me while I was in school. He has a passion for this industry like no other I have seen from any one therapist. Be glad he is on our side fighting for us.
Lisa said:i don't know Mike...this sounds like it could just be a bunch of government officials governing a practice they know nothing about. i am always VERY weary when ANY government body interferes with private practice. when i say "governing" i don't mean government...i mean a national organization.
what credentials will the members be who are picked by the govenor? what guarantee do we as MTs have that this won't turn into a political campaign or kick back? i am more inclined to feel confidence in a massage organization than the government.
why can't we get something like the NCBTMB...something "national" to organize and legitimize our practice? why the government? instead of reinventing the wheel why can't we just fix the pieces that are broken?
you've said a few times that it's "there call not ours". WHY? we as therapists SHOULD have say in how WE are governed. NOT the governor of the state we reside in.
i don't know...i've not had one person yet ask me for my license. and clients seem to be more impressed by the certification than the license. honestly i think most understand that all the license shows is you paid money to the state. certification is what indicates educational standards.
are chiro's and physical therapists certified or licensed? does anyone know the answer to that? i bring them up because i feel they are professions close to ours but widely accepted amongst the public as "legit". are nurses certified or licensed? and how much of the medical professions are licensed only because of pharmaceutical bureaucracy and NOT because of high standards in education?
don't get me wrong. i want MTs to be equal across the board so we all under go the same basic education and then can branch out with specialized education to help us individually stand out amonst our peers. (similar to the medical fields) i want to be able to get my education in one state and work in another. but i DON'T want the government that has NO knowledge of what we do, telling us what to do. that will NOT be good for our profession.
Mike Hinkle said:The following information is my opinion of why you are right!
That's exactly who is doing it, The massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements is the (State) Massage Therapy Board. They are usually picked by the Govenor of the state. The State Massage Board's have gotten together to organize because they saw the industry needs organized. They have already made huge strides in improving the profession.
When associations tried to organize the industry, they were slammed by the other associations and independent therapists. There was little licensing, at that time and it was hard to have any rules. Prostitution was rampant within the industry. Associations promoted licensure hoping to curb the comparisons. States, individually, and with a lot of pressure from therapists within the states started licensing. It has taken decades of effort on AMTA's behalf trying to get us to this point. And yes, I know a lot of folks don't accept that, but it's fact.
The state boards have formed the Federation of States Massage Therapy Boards. This is the organization that will create the Model Practice Act and lead the way to portability among the agreeing states. Will it be all the states? That is up to the states. I would love to see all the states come together. But this is the perfect group to address the entire issue. And they are. I have never felt more confidence in a group as I do this one and their sincere determination to accomplish this for the profession.
At the FSMTB annual meeting, this month, I met people that are lightyears ahead of the average therapist. These people create our hope. I have never been more proud to belong to a profession. And when they finish, you will too.
Lisa said:i'm curious why you feel it needs to be on the state level and not a massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements? and would we still have to get certified AND licensed? that is where i have real issues.
what's the requirements for chiros?
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Permalink Reply by Laura Allen on
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I am on the North Carolina Board of Massage & Bodywork Therapy, along with 4 other massage therapists, a physician member who is a specialist in exercise physiology, and one public member who happens to be an attorney--and he also does Reiki himself. I was this year's NC delegate to the Federation, was there last year as an observer. and can vouch for the fact that most board members are in fact working massage therapists, not some government official that doesn't know squat.
Most states require a certain number of therapists to be on their boards, many require that there is a physician as a member, and all require that there is at least one member of the public who has nothing vested in the massage world on their board.
Prior to serving our state board, I was serving AMTA as a volunteer, and had to resign that as it was considered a conflict of interest. When my five -year term ends in two more years, I expect to go back to doing that. I don't believe in sitting on my hands, and the only way to really change anything is to be involved in it.
Lisa said:i don't know Mike...this sounds like it could just be a bunch of government officials governing a practice they know nothing about. i am always VERY weary when ANY government body interferes with private practice. when i say "governing" i don't mean government...i mean a national organization.
what credentials will the members be who are picked by the govenor? what guarantee do we as MTs have that this won't turn into a political campaign or kick back? i am more inclined to feel confidence in a massage organization than the government.
why can't we get something like the NCBTMB...something "national" to organize and legitimize our practice? why the government? instead of reinventing the wheel why can't we just fix the pieces that are broken?
you've said a few times that it's "there call not ours". WHY? we as therapists SHOULD have say in how WE are governed. NOT the governor of the state we reside in.
i don't know...i've not had one person yet ask me for my license. and clients seem to be more impressed by the certification than the license. honestly i think most understand that all the license shows is you paid money to the state. certification is what indicates educational standards.
are chiro's and physical therapists certified or licensed? does anyone know the answer to that? i bring them up because i feel they are professions close to ours but widely accepted amongst the public as "legit". are nurses certified or licensed? and how much of the medical professions are licensed only because of pharmaceutical bureaucracy and NOT because of high standards in education?
don't get me wrong. i want MTs to be equal across the board so we all under go the same basic education and then can branch out with specialized education to help us individually stand out amonst our peers. (similar to the medical fields) i want to be able to get my education in one state and work in another. but i DON'T want the government that has NO knowledge of what we do, telling us what to do. that will NOT be good for our profession.
Mike Hinkle said:The following information is my opinion of why you are right!
That's exactly who is doing it, The massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements is the (State) Massage Therapy Board. They are usually picked by the Govenor of the state. The State Massage Board's have gotten together to organize because they saw the industry needs organized. They have already made huge strides in improving the profession.
When associations tried to organize the industry, they were slammed by the other associations and independent therapists. There was little licensing, at that time and it was hard to have any rules. Prostitution was rampant within the industry. Associations promoted licensure hoping to curb the comparisons. States, individually, and with a lot of pressure from therapists within the states started licensing. It has taken decades of effort on AMTA's behalf trying to get us to this point. And yes, I know a lot of folks don't accept that, but it's fact.
The state boards have formed the Federation of States Massage Therapy Boards. This is the organization that will create the Model Practice Act and lead the way to portability among the agreeing states. Will it be all the states? That is up to the states. I would love to see all the states come together. But this is the perfect group to address the entire issue. And they are. I have never felt more confidence in a group as I do this one and their sincere determination to accomplish this for the profession.
At the FSMTB annual meeting, this month, I met people that are lightyears ahead of the average therapist. These people create our hope. I have never been more proud to belong to a profession. And when they finish, you will too.
Lisa said:i'm curious why you feel it needs to be on the state level and not a massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements? and would we still have to get certified AND licensed? that is where i have real issues.
what's the requirements for chiros?
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And Laura, I am so glad that you and fellow FSMTB members are doing so much to help organize this profession. Attending the FSMTB meetings would be an eye opener for any therapist that may think it is a government takeover. Thank you all so much for your efforts and volunterism to the industry!
Laura Allen said:I am on the North Carolina Board of Massage & Bodywork Therapy, along with 4 other massage therapists, a physician member who is a specialist in exercise physiology, and one public member who happens to be an attorney--and he also does Reiki himself. I was this year's NC delegate to the Federation, was there last year as an observer. and can vouch for the fact that most board members are in fact working massage therapists, not some government official that doesn't know squat.
Most states require a certain number of therapists to be on their boards, many require that there is a physician as a member, and all require that there is at least one member of the public who has nothing vested in the massage world on their board.
Prior to serving our state board, I was serving AMTA as a volunteer, and had to resign that as it was considered a conflict of interest. When my five -year term ends in two more years, I expect to go back to doing that. I don't believe in sitting on my hands, and the only way to really change anything is to be involved in it.
Lisa said:i don't know Mike...this sounds like it could just be a bunch of government officials governing a practice they know nothing about. i am always VERY weary when ANY government body interferes with private practice. when i say "governing" i don't mean government...i mean a national organization.
what credentials will the members be who are picked by the govenor? what guarantee do we as MTs have that this won't turn into a political campaign or kick back? i am more inclined to feel confidence in a massage organization than the government.
why can't we get something like the NCBTMB...something "national" to organize and legitimize our practice? why the government? instead of reinventing the wheel why can't we just fix the pieces that are broken?
you've said a few times that it's "there call not ours". WHY? we as therapists SHOULD have say in how WE are governed. NOT the governor of the state we reside in.
i don't know...i've not had one person yet ask me for my license. and clients seem to be more impressed by the certification than the license. honestly i think most understand that all the license shows is you paid money to the state. certification is what indicates educational standards.
are chiro's and physical therapists certified or licensed? does anyone know the answer to that? i bring them up because i feel they are professions close to ours but widely accepted amongst the public as "legit". are nurses certified or licensed? and how much of the medical professions are licensed only because of pharmaceutical bureaucracy and NOT because of high standards in education?
don't get me wrong. i want MTs to be equal across the board so we all under go the same basic education and then can branch out with specialized education to help us individually stand out amonst our peers. (similar to the medical fields) i want to be able to get my education in one state and work in another. but i DON'T want the government that has NO knowledge of what we do, telling us what to do. that will NOT be good for our profession.
Mike Hinkle said:The following information is my opinion of why you are right!
That's exactly who is doing it, The massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements is the (State) Massage Therapy Board. They are usually picked by the Govenor of the state. The State Massage Board's have gotten together to organize because they saw the industry needs organized. They have already made huge strides in improving the profession.
When associations tried to organize the industry, they were slammed by the other associations and independent therapists. There was little licensing, at that time and it was hard to have any rules. Prostitution was rampant within the industry. Associations promoted licensure hoping to curb the comparisons. States, individually, and with a lot of pressure from therapists within the states started licensing. It has taken decades of effort on AMTA's behalf trying to get us to this point. And yes, I know a lot of folks don't accept that, but it's fact.
The state boards have formed the Federation of States Massage Therapy Boards. This is the organization that will create the Model Practice Act and lead the way to portability among the agreeing states. Will it be all the states? That is up to the states. I would love to see all the states come together. But this is the perfect group to address the entire issue. And they are. I have never felt more confidence in a group as I do this one and their sincere determination to accomplish this for the profession.
At the FSMTB annual meeting, this month, I met people that are lightyears ahead of the average therapist. These people create our hope. I have never been more proud to belong to a profession. And when they finish, you will too.
Lisa said:i'm curious why you feel it needs to be on the state level and not a massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements? and would we still have to get certified AND licensed? that is where i have real issues.
what's the requirements for chiros?
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Thank you for your input. Second time this week, women have said to legalize it. I really don't think states are going to do this.
Licensing massage, protects states and the public. It gives the states records of therapists and gives states the authority to do things like stop people who make fraudulent claims about energy work or whatever concerning the practice. The majority of the states now license and they are not going back. We will create a standard and it will grow the profession.
ValkyrieOracle said:In my opinion, which may ruffle some feathers, there is a simple solution to this whole thing. Legalize prostitution. I know there are those who view that chosen profession as less than moral but if someone chooses to live that life it's their deal...but I digress. If prostitution was legal then they would not have to use "massage" as a cover. They could advertise openly what services they offer without fear of lash back from law enforcement. That would definitely make the line between true, health based massage practices and massage parlors much more clear. And, in my opinion, it would cut down on the amount of inappropriate clients a real therapist gets. The clients looking for those services would know exactly where to go.
It is blatantly obvious that licensing massage has not weeded out the prostitutes or made the public any more educated on what massage therapy is really all about. As therapists we are having to educate the public one client at a time...and you don't need a license to do that.
I can see both sides of the licensing issue. One the one hand, you want to make sure that therapists are practicing good hygiene and cleanliness habits. Licensing, in theory, enforces those rules on therapists which creates a safer environment for clients. On the other hand, a license doesn't mean you are a good therapist. Some people are born with the gift and others are not, no matter how much school they go to. Licensing gives the false impression to the public that everyone is a good therapist just because they have a license.
Again, this is all just my opinion and I respect the opinions of people who may not agree with me. We are all just trying to do what is best for our profession because it is important to us and to our clients.
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Lisa, this is what I found out today about PT's. My girlfriend is a PT and has been for over 30 years. She has a 4 year Bachlor's Degree. At that time, that was the requirement. She is Licensed in the State of Florida. They do not have any Certification. They do have to take 24 CEU's each 2 years in order to renew their license just like we do. They also have to take HIV, Domestic Violence, which I thought was interesting, Law, Ethics, etc, the same as us. Their program now is a Masters program and soon they are talking about changing it to a Doctorate program, which my friend said was not necessary. She said that was way over the line. She also said Domestic Violence is on the rise and that is why it is a required CEU for them. If they move to another state they do have to take Law and Ethics, etc, in the new State, and also the State licensing exam in the new state since they do not have any national certification. I hope all this helps.
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:Lisa, I just got off the telephone with my Girlfriend who is a RN and Licensed in the State of Florida and Mississippi. It just so happened that she got off work at midnight tonight and I knew that info. Anyway, They too, have to take so many hours of CEU's in order to renew their license every two years. They also have modalities to study in the medical field just like we do in the massage industry. I was just told that when they complete a new modality they take a National Certification so they can use that modality in whatever state they are working.
I also have a friend who is a PT. I will call her tomorrow and find out what kind of License/Certification she has. I do know she has been a PT for years and has a 4 year degree plus a masters degree in her field.
I am also a CNA Certified in the State of Florida since 1983. I do also have to have CEU's to continue that certification. it is a State Certification, NOT National Certification. I also have to pass one of the moist strictest of background checks in the State of Florida to be able to work with the Elderly, which is one in the same for working in a daycare with children. Elder abuse and child abuse in the State of Florida are looked upon very seriously and are felonies.
Mike has the best interest of all of us at heart. He would never do anything that would hurt us as LMT's or this industy. He was my massage therapist for years, and also mentored me while I was in school. He has a passion for this industry like no other I have seen from any one therapist. Be glad he is on our side fighting for us.
Lisa said:i don't know Mike...this sounds like it could just be a bunch of government officials governing a practice they know nothing about. i am always VERY weary when ANY government body interferes with private practice. when i say "governing" i don't mean government...i mean a national organization.
what credentials will the members be who are picked by the govenor? what guarantee do we as MTs have that this won't turn into a political campaign or kick back? i am more inclined to feel confidence in a massage organization than the government.
why can't we get something like the NCBTMB...something "national" to organize and legitimize our practice? why the government? instead of reinventing the wheel why can't we just fix the pieces that are broken?
you've said a few times that it's "there call not ours". WHY? we as therapists SHOULD have say in how WE are governed. NOT the governor of the state we reside in.
i don't know...i've not had one person yet ask me for my license. and clients seem to be more impressed by the certification than the license. honestly i think most understand that all the license shows is you paid money to the state. certification is what indicates educational standards.
are chiro's and physical therapists certified or licensed? does anyone know the answer to that? i bring them up because i feel they are professions close to ours but widely accepted amongst the public as "legit". are nurses certified or licensed? and how much of the medical professions are licensed only because of pharmaceutical bureaucracy and NOT because of high standards in education?
don't get me wrong. i want MTs to be equal across the board so we all under go the same basic education and then can branch out with specialized education to help us individually stand out amonst our peers. (similar to the medical fields) i want to be able to get my education in one state and work in another. but i DON'T want the government that has NO knowledge of what we do, telling us what to do. that will NOT be good for our profession.
Mike Hinkle said:The following information is my opinion of why you are right!
That's exactly who is doing it, The massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements is the (State) Massage Therapy Board. They are usually picked by the Govenor of the state. The State Massage Board's have gotten together to organize because they saw the industry needs organized. They have already made huge strides in improving the profession.
When associations tried to organize the industry, they were slammed by the other associations and independent therapists. There was little licensing, at that time and it was hard to have any rules. Prostitution was rampant within the industry. Associations promoted licensure hoping to curb the comparisons. States, individually, and with a lot of pressure from therapists within the states started licensing. It has taken decades of effort on AMTA's behalf trying to get us to this point. And yes, I know a lot of folks don't accept that, but it's fact.
The state boards have formed the Federation of States Massage Therapy Boards. This is the organization that will create the Model Practice Act and lead the way to portability among the agreeing states. Will it be all the states? That is up to the states. I would love to see all the states come together. But this is the perfect group to address the entire issue. And they are. I have never felt more confidence in a group as I do this one and their sincere determination to accomplish this for the profession.
At the FSMTB annual meeting, this month, I met people that are lightyears ahead of the average therapist. These people create our hope. I have never been more proud to belong to a profession. And when they finish, you will too.
Lisa said:i'm curious why you feel it needs to be on the state level and not a massage governing body that oversee's all state requirements? and would we still have to get certified AND licensed? that is where i have real issues.
what's the requirements for chiros?
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I do not know if it sends out Birthday cards. I will let you know if I receive one in March from them.
Mike Hinkle said:I give up, computers are going to replace us.... yet right! Sounds neat! Does it send out Birthday Cards to the clientel?
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:Yes, it is a really nice computerized system. Each therapist is listed by shift and then the booking is displayed under their name. It is all color coded so we know if someone is coming in for the first time or is a repeat, has been called to confirm the appointment or sent an email confirmation etc. Then for no shows it puts a big X over their info. I have never seen anything like it until now. It also displays special requets by the client for a therapist, if it is Deep Tissue, Reflexology, etc, and Pre Natal etc. You would love it.
Mike Hinkle said:Cool!
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:It really is not a bother to me. There is a display stand on each self in the rooms. The problem is sometimes I do forget to move the license, espeacilly if I have a back to back massage and have to change rooms and the massage has not been communicated correctly on the computer. We have a computerized booking system that is dislayed in the therapist break room so we know if there are couples coming in for a massage. Sometimes the couple is displayed as separate massages, and then changed at the very last minute to a couples massage.
Mike Hinkle said:They are there for a reason. Does it bother you to have to do that? Seems like it takes care of the legit thing. And with the licensure they can check the state page to check if it is real. Sounds easy to me.
Darcy Neibaur BS LMT NCTMB said:Where I work now, we have to display our Massage License in the room we are working so the clients have access to them. If we change rooms the license must go with us to the new room. If we do a couples massage the license goes to that room. It is all about the Clients being able to check and see that we are legal LMT's. At the center they were displayed on a bulliten board. No more of that. They are displayed on a stand in the room.
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Permalink Reply by Cynthia Aubin on
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Wow , what a deep deep subject!!
I feel that people as time goes by will know what is theraputic and what is prostition, the difference will be very clear.
As far as licensing we need that to acknlowdege who is knowlegable and who is not.
State to state yes is not necessary but right now it is what we have. i have tried to change states and that is very hard especially coming from Texas, but if you have a gift and the knowledge you will be fine in this profeesion.
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Permalink Reply by Keith Eric Grant on
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I'd do a brief answer (I hope) to Lisa's question, "Why the State?".
The 14th amendment of the U.S. constitution protects the right to engage in commerce and stipulates a right to do business except where there is a countervailing public interest imposed by due process. The Supreme Court ruling of Dent v. State of West Virginia, 129 U.S. 114 (1889) set out the principle that the state can limit the practice of occupations when it implements a needed public protection from harms of incompetence and malfeasance. There is thus, embodied in occupational licensing, a fine constitutional balance between freedom of commerce and intrusion of the police power of the state upon commerce for the benefit of the public. In allowing a state to determine public benefit, the standard of rational basis is normally used, except when the law involves a suspect classification that might involve discrimination (e.g. race, gender, national origin). In this case, the more stringent test of strict scrutiny is applied.
There can be other limits imposed upon regulation of a profession. The decision of California Liquor Dealers v. Midcal Aluminum, 445 U.S. 97 (1980) imposed restrictions on the use of private agencies in implementing regulation (or other trade restrictions) if state action immunity from the Sherman anti-trust law is to be maintained. The Midcal decision notes two criteria for immunity from anti-trust: first, the restraint must be "one clearly articulated and affirmatively expressed as state policy"; second, the policy must be "actively supervised" by the State itself. The court also noted that the state cannot simply pass a law delegating its authority and responsibility to regulate professions:
The national policy in favor of competition cannot be thwarted by casting such a gauzy cloak of state involvement over what is essentially a private price-fixing arrangement. As Parker teaches, "a state does not give immunity to those who violate the Sherman Act by authorizing them to violate it, or by declaring that their action is lawful
The federal government, except in very rare cases such as aviation, does not regulate occupations. Nor can any private agency provide more than voluntary certification. The sole responsibility and power for occupational regulation rests with the individual states, which can not delegate that authority if the requlation is mandatory. A state board or regulatory agency is still part of the state itself.
The state boards and regulatory agencies can come together in association, discuss, and work toward some level of agreement and consensus on how to best fulfill the responsibility to regulate for the public benefit. That is what is occuring with FSMTB. FSMTB cannot dictate to the states, but it can, by association, help them to fulfill their individual responsibilities. It is still the states that are active in making the decisions, and thus state action immunity from anti-trust is maintained.
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Hi Cynthia,
I remember Texas. But they are coming together now. They have a strong system and I think they will be fine.
Cynthia Aubin said:Wow , what a deep deep subject!!
I feel that people as time goes by will know what is theraputic and what is prostition, the difference will be very clear.
As far as licensing we need that to acknlowdege who is knowlegable and who is not.
State to state yes is not necessary but right now it is what we have. i have tried to change states and that is very hard especially coming from Texas, but if you have a gift and the knowledge you will be fine in this profeesion.
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